Becoming wealthy is not just about luck. But did you know you can actually increase your chances of luck? Happiness isn’t something that’s solely dependent upon external circumstances. But it’s something that can be learned. How do we increase our chances of luck? How do we become wealthy, how do we learn to be happy, what are the principles that should guide our efforts, and what does daily progress really look like?

Well, Naval Ravikant is an entrepreneur, philosopher, and investor who is captivated the world with his principles for building wealth and creating long term happiness. In the new book, The Almanack of Naval Ravikant, author Eric Jorgenson has distilled more than a million words of Naval’s wisdom and experience from the last 10 years into an insightful, poignant book that reads like a conversation you might have with someone you admire.

This isn’t a how-to book or a step-by-step gimmick. Instead, through Naval’s own words, you will learn how to walk your own unique path toward a happier, wealthier life. In today’s podcast, Eric shares with us some of his favorite tips. Enjoy.

Miles Rote: Hey everyone, my name is Miles Rote and I’m excited to be here today with Eric Jorgenson, author of The Almanack of Naval Ravikant: A Guide to Wealth and Happiness. Eric, I’m excited you’re here, welcome to the Author Hour podcast.

Eric Jorgenson: Me too, thanks Miles.

Miles Rote: This is such a cool idea for a book and I’m really excited to dive in and tell the listeners what it’s all about. But first, tell us a little bit about you and your background?

Eric Jorgenson: I come from the startup world which is how I found Naval. My first introduction to the valley was someone telling me my god, you have to go read everything that Naval has ever written on this blog. That has been my world for the last 10 years, working in tech startups and blogging and writing on the side.

I’ve been a voracious reader since I could walk. There’s been a long history of appreciating books and always thinking that I would love to put one together someday. It’s really cool to see this all come together.

Miles Rote: You stumble on Naval Ravikant and you see all the work that he’s done and it blows you away and basically you feel inspired to put together an almanac essentially of what his ideas represent?

Eric Jorgenson: Kind of, yeah. It’s a very evolutionary thing as I look back on it. You know, I started reading Naval when it was just a blog about how to raise venture capital and some of the game theory behind startups in 2011 was when he started doing that. Over 10 years, I followed his Twitter and I saw more of his talks. He started doing more interviews and started talking more about a breath of topics–not just a tactic of startups but getting more into the principles behind wealth creation or synthesizing some of what he learned about philosophy and happiness and studying Buddhism. I have been interested in pretty much everything that he has talked about.

He shared thoughts about the education system and what the future of education might look like and he’s also very early into blockchain. I’ve always been interested in whatever the thing is that he happens to be talking about for the last 10 years. On the side, I was reading all of these books that were other compilations, remixes from the letters of Warren Buffett or from Poor Charlie’s Almanac or Zero To One, Peter Thiel’s book that Blake Masters had put together. Peter Bevelin has written some of my favorite books and uses the raw materials from Warren Buffett and Charlie Munger.

That format, the remix book as a format has always been influential to me and so putting those pieces together, as Naval shared more and more amazing stuff that I thought people would really benefit from. This really tipped with his podcast on The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish–the Farnam Street podcast was amazing.

I listened to it a few times and Shane has said it’s one of his most popular podcast ever. Naval has done great interviews with Joe Rogan and Tim Ferris. Those things started coming together a few years ago and Naval really blew up to a much bigger audience and I could tell people were getting so much out of them.

It all really deserves a more evergreen format and I was lucky to have the perspective and the time to put in to turn it into a book.

A Tweet that Launched a Book

Miles Rote: That’s so amazing. I totally agree, there are so many of these nuggets of wisdom spread throughout, and being able to bring them all together and create a comprehensive, cohesive almanac of sorts where people can essentially get so much of his knowledge all in one place is pretty amazing.

How did this come to be? Did you reach out to Naval and tell him about this idea and got his blessing?

Eric Jorgenson: Somewhat accidentally. It’s a lot less deliberate than that makes it sound. I had this kernel of an idea and just tweeted it one night with a pun that I thought in retrospect is very dumb but a 10 PM tweet. I went to bed and woke up and Naval had retweeted me throwing this idea out and almost 4,000 people were like, my God, we want that. Well, I guess I’m committed now.

If I’m going to do it, I’m going to do it right. Naval and I started emailing and he provided some of the raw materials and 20,000 tweets, the full history of his Twitter. That was the starting place and then I went and collected a lot of transcripts. I assembled all the raw materials and started to look at all of the different categories of thoughts that he shared. I started to group them and thread ideas together and figured out across 10 years of him evolving these thoughts. I was able to explain them with more and more clarity by finding the best phrasing of each one of these thoughts and then distilling that down and threading it together and organizing it into something that feels cohesive to read and like Naval is personally talking to you.

That’s one of the things I love about the final product. So much of this came from interviews–one on one conversations, that it puts the reader at the center of it and it feels much more like a dialogue. It’s not very formal, you know, it draws you into this conversational mode. I find it really easy to keep reading and keep getting pulled in.

Miles Rote: Yeah, I wanted to make a comment on that too. I totally agree as well. There are certain books that are so informationally driven, and it can be wonderful to read but it could be draining, whereas this book really feels like a conversation about really engaging topics and things that we care about most. It’s very poignant too. There are not a lot of wasted words at all or going off on tangents, it really stays on point. Let’s dig into it a little bit.

As the title suggests, the book is really divided into two parts. Wealth and money. Let’s begin with wealth and there’s something that I hadn’t thought about, but it really starts with this idea of thinking about how wealth is created. How is wealth created?

Eric Jorgenson: Yeah, Naval breaks it down into this formula of principles. So, you have a handful of guiding things. Wealth is created not with your direct investment of time but through leverage, using your specific knowledge and usually owning equity in a business.

What he says is if you look at all the people who are truly wealthy, not just have a high income and buy expensive things like maybe doctors or lawyers, but that actually build wealth over time and have that wealth compounding on itself, they’re usually people who own equity in a business. That equity carries the upside and it is in the business itself, which is usually leveraged and so, when there’s one idea or one product, a business’s role is to replicate that as many times as possible and deliver that value to as many people as possible.

You know, you see someone like Elon Musk getting incredibly wealthy because he devised this formula for creating a wonderful product like the Tesla that everyone wants. They can do it over and over again and the upside of that goes to the equity holders of that business. Elon Musk is one of the largest equity holders of the business, he creates this valuable product.

That is the formula that you see, and he was able to do that because of the specific knowledge that he had accrued in salesmanship and design and engineering. It is a beautiful breakdown and once you see the patterns that Naval sets out in the principles, you can look around you at all these different success stories and identify how people use their specific knowledge, how they use their leverage, how they took accountability–whether they had equity in a business or not. Whether it’s someone in the startup world who got stock options in Facebook or a public market investor who bought equity or made the money trading equities. Those are different applications of the same distilled principle.

What is Wealth?

Miles Rote: There’s a quote in the book where it’s Naval speaking on the difference between wealth and money and it really changed the way that I thought about it because I always thought of them synonymously. The quote is, ‘Seek wealth, not money or status. Wealth is having assets that earn while you sleep. Money is how we transfer time and wealth.”

I thought that was a brilliant way of reframing the entire thing in my mind.

Eric Jorgenson: I think a lot of people conflate a lot of different ideas when they think about wealth, when they think about money, and when they think about income even. You could go a lot further with things that people confuse with wealth when you actually look for it.

I think Tim Ferris in The 4-Hour Work Week had another interesting definition of it early on. The dream isn’t to have a million dollars in the bank account, that’s just a number, the real dream is to have the freedom and the money to do what you want to and the time and the freedom to actually live the way you want.

Using some of those ideas to take apart this tangly confusing mess of I don’t have enough money, I don’t have enough freedom, I’m not wealthy, to figuring out what the constraint actually is. And then how you can pull those principles apart and tackle them individually to get closer to living the life you want to live.

Miles Rote: Yeah, you bring up a good point because a big part of wealth for a lot of people is identity and what that means to them and how they even define money. There’s another quote in your book, “If you secretly despise wealth, it will elude you.” How does identity play into this whole idea?

Eric Jorgenson: Yeah, I think that’s a really interesting question and probably a deep one for people who haven’t made this distinction. Naval also says very close to that excerpt that there are people playing wealth games and there are people playing status games. A lot of people who are playing the status game are trying to lower people playing wealth games or attack them in order to win at the status game. So politics is a very easy route on status games and what you want to do in those is all about the social hierarchy, it’s all about putting other people down and putting yourself up or forming a mob around yourself to attack someone else.

The status game and the wealth creation game are just so very different. They are heading in different directions and have different ethos. The wealth-building game, despite what many people say, is often incredibly positive-sum. A bigger pie for everyone is better for everyone. Whereas the status-seeking is very zero-sum. If someone else is ahead of you then that is bad for you and you need to get ahead of them. Detangling those and learning to see wealth creation as a positive-sum game where every move you make helps someone else and helps you, can really unlock some of that.

If you are interacting with people in a way that you resent what they have, people are very attuned to that. We’re incredibly sensitive, social creatures and we are subconsciously processing threats and hostility and evaluations and judgments between each other all the time.

If you are not dealing with someone earnestly and positively and with true belief that what you are doing is good for them and good for you, you’re just not going to find success in that game.

Miles Rote: Yeah, speaking of games, you bring up these status games and then there’s on the other side of it too, this idea that you talk about in the book of long term games and how we should focus on playing these long term games and that can be a hard thing to even think about or conceptualize, let alone in the moment, as you mentioned we’re subconsciously processing all of these things and biologically reacting instead of responding to all these different things in our environment and really, it’s as if we’re always playing the short term games in every moment. How can we zoom out and think about this longer-term game?

Eric Jorgenson: One of my favorite quotes from Naval, is so extreme that it’s hard to forget, is, “If you’re not willing to work with someone for your whole life, don’t work with them for a day.” It just frames so starkly how important it is to choose only to work and interact with people who you are willing to spend your whole life with.

It makes you appreciate every day. It makes you think really hard about who you want to get involved with on a personal and professional level. It’s all about this long-term game. It really goes into compounding the idea that if you’re going to do anything for a short period of time, it’s probably not going to matter in the scheme of things. Oddly, it only matters, it only causes harm in the incredibly short term but you can’t create very many good things in the incredibly short term.

Thinking about all of the results that you want to get as a result of compounding–compounding in relationships, compounding in building judgment, compounding in building wealth–so all of the investments that you make into those principles, are a foundation of what grows over time. Allowing that 10 to become 11 to become 12, to become 14, to become 17, to become 21 and seeing that, the wonder of compounding over a long period of time and having the patience to stay the course and keep investing in the things that you know are going to compound.

It’s easier said than done but I find it helpful to keep studying it and keep reading and keep reiterating things like this that keep you true to the path and keep showing you that these investments in compounding returns are going to pay off.

So, staying focused on the long term and remembering that the last piece of that wealth creation chapter is to be patient. If you’re changing focus, if you’re changing direction all the time, you’re going to interrupt that compounding process and it’s going to be really hard to see the results of it and to really build up a head of steam in whatever direction you’re going.

Miles Rote: I have to bring up another quote because there’s so many good quotes in this book and it’s speaking to exactly what you’re saying now, “If it entertains you now but will bore you someday, it’s a distraction. Keep looking.” I think it is really thinking about all of this longer-term. A really hard and important thing that you talk about in the book is accountability and taking ownership of these things.

What do you recommend for anyone out there that struggles with that? How can we be more accountable to ourselves?

Eric Jorgenson: Yeah, accountability is a very interesting and loaded word. I love that Naval uses it and distills it because I think it is much better phrasing than the classic, ‘it takes risk to earn a reward,’ or entrepreneurs take on risk, it’s really about taking responsibility and managing that risk and being willing to put yourself out there, not in an unnecessarily reckless way, but in a way that you are personally culpable for the results.

It pushes you to be your best self. It pushes you to only place bets that you feel like you have the judgment and the awareness of, that the odds are pretty good. So, it keeps you inside your circle of competence.

The other piece I would say for building accountability is that no one talks about this with more of an iron prescription than Taleb. Reading Skin in the Game, reading Anti Fragile, reading Fooled By Randomness, all really encourage you to find and accept accountability for the things that you work on. Taleb talks about this all the way back to Hammurabi’s Code.

If you build a bridge, you sleep under it the first night, somebody’s driving over it. You are accountable for the outcomes of your actions and anybody who is trying to avoid accountability for their actions should be regarded very suspiciously and is probably on some level rejected from social society. It’s not that that risk goes away, it is just that people who are not taking personal accountability are pushing that risk off on to other people who may or may not even know that they’re accepting the risk.

There’s a lot of socialized risk-taking going on in our world today. Looking for ways to accept accountability can counteract that and it’s worth saying that the rewards go to the people who take accountability. These are the reasons that people start their business with a family name, it’s the reason that the equity holders are responsible for the downside, they’re the first ones who wiped out if a business goes bankrupt but they’re the ones who get the upside if the business goes well. It’s the reason that captains go down with the ship.

This accountability principle in society goes back very deeply into very important character and culture and keeping us responsible for our actions. It is true and right that we should be rewarded for taking accountability. We should always be accountable for our successes and our failures but learning to seek that help and being willing to accept it, it focuses you into areas of your specific talent and it keeps you honest. It is the right way to earn the wealth creation that you’re seeking.

Accountability

Miles Rote: I love that and definitely agree there is the flipside to accountability or at least maybe on the surface it may seem that way, and that is luck. We don’t consider luck to be something that we are accountable for but in the book, you discuss that is not actually the case. You can actually increase your chances of luck. What does that look like?

Eric Jorgenson: Yeah, I like this a lot because luck is often used to shirk responsibility or accountability. Realizing that you can create your own luck to some degree is a hugely powerful thing. I don’t remember who coined it, but I remember reading years ago about the concept of luck surface area and that you can increase the size of your net where good things fall.

Naval breaks luck down into four concepts in the book. It basically says that the highest form of luck is to become so specialized that you are the only opportunity for people who need your skillset and then lucky things will just happen to you. You call it luck because you won’t really know what else to attribute it to, but if you are the only person who can deliver a certain result, the world will find their way to you. It will feel like luck, which is the complete opposite of the talentless, lottery winning, blind luck, where you are truly just submitting to the odds and hoping something good happens.

You can work methodically towards accepting more luck into your life and positioning yourself so that more of that happens. I think it is a fascinating study and there is a lot more to read and learn about that–using that phrasing is engineering luck or creating your own luck. It is charming. It makes you feel a little more magical and a little bit more secretive.

Miles Rote: You are in control of your destiny. There is the idea of self-accountable luck and I would love to read the four ways that he breaks it down, which is you can either hope that luck finds you, which I think a lot of us do. You can hustle until you stumble into it, you can prepare the mind and be sensitive to chances that others miss, which I love and then there is this last thing that you touch upon, which is you could become the best at what you do and refine what you do until this is true, until you’re the very best.

Then opportunity will seek you out and luck will become your destiny. It is such a different way. It turns luck on its head.

Eric Jorgenson: Luck will become your destiny is an amazing line. I think about Warren Buffett as the ultimate example of someone with the reputation and the cash and the person that luck seeks out. There is not a lot of people who get a phone call from the government when the economy crashes.

So, when you think about something like the analogy that Naval uses in the book, which is about deep-sea diving. If you are the foremost deep-sea diver in the world and you can go deeper for longer than anyone else can, and someone finds a treasure chest at the bottom of the ocean. You are the only one who can reach it, then whoever finds it, anyone in the world, their luck becomes your luck and luck becomes your destiny, which is much more of a metaphor than anything literal. It is a powerful thing that you can look at how to apply in your own life.

Miles Rote: Let’s try to move on to happiness now. I want to keep talking about wealth because there’s so much but let’s move on to happiness. I am going to start with the big question here, can happiness be learned?

Eric Jorgenson: Happiness can be learned. That is the core insight of the whole second half of the book. I don’t think this is in the book, but I remember it being a story that Naval told about the beginning of his happiness journey. Naval was very successful and very admired but he would have said that he is not particularly happy. Someone asked him the question, “Well, if you are so smart and you’re so successful, why can’t you be happy?”

He took this as, “Oh yeah, I have always thought of myself as smart and high agency and able to do whatever I wanted to do, so why can’t I learn to be happy? Why can’t I control that?” And as soon as he started seeing it as a skill that he could build and something that he could study, he started tweeting more about it and talking more about it. Reading some of the resources that are in the book, you start to see habits change and how he talks about things changes.

I thought it was so interesting that it all had to start with the belief that happiness is malleable and a skill that you can learn–that it is not a trait that you are born with. We don’t all have some fixed level of happiness. We completely control our mind and our perspectives, and we can choose to become happier and learn to become happier in the same way that you can chose to become stronger or chose to become smarter.

Miles Rote: There is a quote that hits on exactly that point. “We think of ourselves as fixed and the world is malleable, but it is really we who are malleable, and the world is largely fixed.” Again, it is that same idea that we are in control of these things and there aren’t external forces that really determine our emotions–it really comes from us.

Eric Jorgenson: The only thing we can control is how we perceive and react to the events that are happening to us. It is another one of the those things that is so stark and you don’t want it to be true because your experiences told you that it is not and your upbringing sometimes tells you that it is not. But once you accept it as a truth, you start to live differently, and you start to think about your decisions differently. You can choose happiness at any moment.

You can choose to focus on the present in any moment. One of the chapter headings is happiness requires presence and so to stay present in every moment, if you are living in the past or you’re living in the future, you’ve already lost. Staying in the moment and being able to find happiness. Even the smallest pleasures, sit down with the cantaloupe and if you actually are completely present with this thing, you notice how it is a miracle of nature, and it is tasty and it is juicy and it is crispy, and it was grown halfway around the world and traveled all the way over to you. Now it is only three dollars and there are all of these miracles on the plate in front of you. If you stop and think about how your nose is creating this sense that your brain is interpreting as a sweet tropical smell. The more you zoom in on life and live in the moment, things can completely change for you.

Miles Rote: There are miracles everywhere when we can get back to presence, even turning on your kitchen sink or taking a hot shower, it can be one those things that is transcendental where we’re at in this world and then what we get to enjoy in this world and how we can all feel so magical. The idea that we are responsible for our own happiness comes back to that sense of accountability. So, we find ourselves back with that same idea of having to take ownership of our own happiness, not only wealth but happiness.

So, what are ways that we can do that? I feel like self-care really enters into this conversation now. Once we have this understanding that we are accountable for our own happiness, what are some ways that we can really, besides presence, nurture and foster that?

Eric Jorgenson: There is a section of habits of happiness in the book that gets into some relatively tactical things, which is rare for the book. The book is very principles focused for the most part. But habits of happiness, just to list a few off the top of my head, Naval says avoid alarm clocks. Avoid things that force you into rushing in or out of the moment that you’re in. Reducing the amount of scheduled appointments that you have.

A small that I think is a good trigger is when you feel the sun, smile and look up. It is such a small thing. Getting sun on your skin every day goes a long way to creating some of that happiness. It is such a basic evolutionary thing that we forget about when we’re surrounded by appliances and air conditioning and all of these modern conveniences that in any particular short-term moment might feel better than being five degrees warmer than where we want to be.

There is something intrinsically rewarding about experiencing nature. You know that is one of the things that has been widely studied to be correlated with happiness is nature bathing or sunbathing or walking around in a forest, feeling grass under your feet instead of concrete. These are just the little things that can make you smile, and you can find ways to be present with them and have gratitude for them. There is a lot more in the book. Those are just a few things off the top of my head.

Habits of Happiness

Miles Rote: Yeah, I’m really glad you bring those up. There is something called forest therapy as I am sure you are aware of, and we have been evolving for millions of years, and the more we can align ourselves with what is most natural to our evolution, it makes very logical sense that the better off we’re going to be. As you mentioned, those things can feel so small.

When we’re being marketed towards in every moment all of these other external things that would make us happier, and we feel because they are rarer or more expensive or have a price tag that somehow, they might be more important to our happiness. Really it is about getting down to those fundamental things that make us human and being grateful for waking up and walking through the forest.

Eric Jorgenson: Yeah, I lived in San Francisco for a few years and I always remember, going to visit friends in Berkley and getting off at the park in Berkley and all of a sudden hearing birds for the first time in two months. I would feel my shoulders relax and think, “Oh this just sounds so good.” You just smile and you don’t even exactly know why.

Miles Rote: Yep, okay so there is one more aspect of happiness that I want to talk about and that is values. I feel like values are one of those things that can be guardrails for us in our life that can help us keep us on track. How do values play into happiness?

Eric Jorgenson: Yeah, I think how Naval phrases it is very interesting. It is that any sort of dishonestly removes you from the moment. It necessarily destroys your presence and destroys your happiness because as soon as you’re entering any deceit, you have to split your brain and now you are thinking about the perception and the reality. You are hiding something and that is a difficult mental process. It takes you away from this moment and this experience and it makes you nervous.

Now all of a sudden you have something to hide. When you’re living by your values it is the way to live honestly and clearly. You’re relaxed in a simple way that is not only for all of the important moral reasons and for people to be able to rely on you, but even for the most selfish reasons. Living by your values is a root of happiness.

Another in this theme that we have hit on of is that short term difficulty makes for a positive thing in the long term. One moment of telling someone the truth about what you think can make for a much harder conversation at this moment, but it means that you can live your values and you can live your truth and you can be transparent. You can be relaxed, and you can be present. That person will know that you were straight forward with them and you are honest.

Naval is famous in the valley for these radically honest assessments of the quality and use of his time. Such as leaving in the middle of dinner parties if he decides that it is a waste of his time and he doesn’t want to be there anymore. Things that would be or are perceived as rude he’s just like, “Well, this is my truth. I want to leave. I’m leaving, can’t stop me. Bye.” Which I find a hilarious idiosyncrasy. I am not quite at good at it as he is, but I very much appreciate how much he lives those values. I aspire to one day leave a dinner party in the middle of it.

Miles Rote: Yeah, it goes back to something that you talk about in the book. The idea that making an easy choice leads to a hard life and making hard choices leads to an easy life.

Eric Jorgenson: I think that was a Jerzy Gregorek quote, who is one of Naval’s trainers. It is a perfect synthesis of all of these ideas that saving now is going to mean that you have money that compounds later, working out now means you’re going to be healthier later. Being honest now means that you can be relaxed and happy later. Absorbing that idea of being willing to do the hard thing in the short term and seeing those patterns over and over and developing that instinct to just do it. Making that your reflex rather than hiding from that short-term pain.

Miles Rote: Love it. Eric, I really enjoyed your book. I really hope people check it out. It’s incredible and you do such a good job of distilling such important critical information that can improve people’s lives. Thank you and writing a book is no joke, so first of all congratulations. I know this has been a couple of years of labor for you. So, if readers could take away one or two things from your book, what would they be?

Eric Jorgenson: Yeah, it’s been a couple of years in the making and not just for me but for a whole team of wonderful people. Jack Butcher did the illustration and he is incredibly brilliant. He started the Visualize Value project. If you like the Almanack, you will love some of the stuff that he does visually with Naval and a lot of other similar people. There is a lot to learn all the way from Marcus Aurelius up to today.

I had a wonderful editor in Kathleen Martin and then it is pandering because I am on your podcast, but the Scribe team has been truly incredible. This book has been very smoothly worked and published through just a maelstrom of bullshit in the macro and micro of my life. It’s been a huge relief to have professional, organized people driving this forward and being sure that years of work are delivered to the market in a polished and professional way. It has been amazing.

I get asked that question a lot about what the takeaways are, and I don’t have a good answer. Because I think it is a very unique book. Most books are one idea expanded to 50,000 words and run over and over again with different examples and different studies and stories, and this book started with well over a million words of source material and it is a lifetime of Naval’s lessons and learnings and the things that he has observed. All of that is distilled down into the most insight dense, life-changing 50,000 words I can possibly make out of that source material after a lot of editing and a lot of peer reviews.

I think that if you talk to a hundred different people who read this book they will have taken one different main take away from it, whether it is from the wealth section and they totally change how they approach their career or one of the ideas from happiness becomes their mantra or happiness is a choice or that happiness requires presence and they just think about that all the time and that has changed how they look at the world. I think people will have different takeaways and I think they will have different takeaways if they pick up the book two years after or even a month after. We are never the same person that picks up a book twice and I’ve re-read a few books in my life that have meant completely different things to me at different times.

I am excited to see how that can evolve and how people can grow with and around some of these insights. I am already hearing really fascinating things from people who have had early copies of the book and what they took away from it. I hope to have a lot more.

Miles Rote: Yeah, get ready for a lot more. Eric, this has been such a pleasure. I’m so excited for people to check out the book. Everyone, the book is called, The Almanack of Naval Ravikant: A Guide to Wealth and Happiness, and you can find it on Amazon. Eric besides checking out the book, where can people find you?

Eric Jorgenson: I am on Twitter @ericjorgenson. I have a website with some personal writing at ejorgenson.com and I know the title is a little bit of a mouthful, but we had to do it. So, the nickname that I have been using is Navalmanack. Feel free to take that as your own.

Miles Rote: I love it. Eric, thanks again for writing this book and distilling such wisdom for all of us. I am really grateful for it.

Eric Jorgenson: Thanks Miles. I should say the book is available for free in all digital forms and on the website at navalmanack.com. So, if you can’t get it wherever you are, you can find it all on the website. You can download the PDF, you can find it and get access to it wherever you need it. Don’t let the 20 bucks stop you from getting access to these insights because I think they could really help anybody.

Miles Rote: Amazing. Thank you so much for making that available to everyone.

Eric Jorgenson: Yep.

Miles Rote: All right Eric, such a pleasure.

Eric Jorgenson: Thanks, Miles.