Our society is an ever-changing reflection of what we buy into. From our deepest fears to our greatest hopes, from the companies that fail, to the ones that thrive. If your business is on a mission to provide authentic value and achieve a positive impact, society doesn’t just need you to think about sales and marketing, it needs you to be great at them. 

Attention is hard to come by in today’s hyper-competitive world, it takes real effort to earn it. Don’t let companies that lack integrity continue to dominate the conversation. The new book, Selling with Love, is designed to shift your way of thinking about sales, unlocking your ability to further your mission without hesitation and without compromise. Achieve results and do it your way.

Once you know how to do it and you truly understand why it’s so important, you’ll be unstoppable in your growth and impact and either more aligned with your core values.

This is The Author Hour Podcast and I’m your host, Frank Garza. Today, I’m joined by Jason Marc Campbell, author of a brand-new book, Selling With Love: Earn with Integrity and Expand Your Impact. Jason, welcome to the show.

Jason Marc Campbell: Hey, glad to be here, thanks for having me.

Frank Garza: To kick things off, could you please just give us a brief summary of your background and how that led to you writing this new book?

Jason Marc Campbell: Yeah. I’ve went into a few different industries but if we go way, way back, I’ve been somebody who had a chance to sell swimming pools in Canada, and that kind of goes around that stereotype that we all live in igloos. No, we have swimming pools and it was an industry that was really fun to sell for and it was a family business.

When I got a chance to start selling there, it was very interesting because you basically had to demonstrate the product. People were excited, they had this kind of enthusiasm about bringing in a pool because you can imagine in Canada, it’s not like you have that pool in the backyard and you forget about it. You actually have winter that does come through and when spring season comes, you’re tired of winter, you’re exhausted and summer is coming. You start having this idea that, “Wow, I’d love to have a pool in the backyard” and I got to be the recipient of that enthusiasm.

This was a really fun sales experience that I was maybe 16, 17 at the time and so people would walk in there, like, “We’re tired of winter, we’d love to have a pool in our backyard.” I’d be like, “Hey, let me help.” This was kind of some of the first sales introductions that I had and I loved working there because it was a place where I got to learn how to sell from a place of not like, “Hey, you need to hit the quotas. You need to do this aggressively. You need to manipulate people.” 

It was really just understanding that if you treat people with respect, you really introduce them to the product, you sit down with them, you listen to them and you try to help them make the best choice, really was kind of the foundation of my methodology and my mindset around sales which is going to be everything about from a place of love. Fast forwarding from these teen years, I ended up working in real estate. I ended up selling people into building up their real estate investment portfolios, giving them education around that. 

I’ve bought and sold real estate myself as an investor. Fast forward from that, I ended up working for a company called Mind Valley. This was a really pivotal time where I got a chance to sell — it’s an education technology company and I got to sell personal development. Things that actually transform people’s lives and made a huge impact on their happiness, their mindfulness, their health and fitness, their productivity, and their career. It was really a fantastic thing to do and I realized that I had a chance to sell such quality products that I got excited about, all the mechanisms that they would use to put the products in the hands of the masses.

Whether it was through online product launches, [or] through these ongoing funnels I really got a chance to discover this world of online marketing, sales. Myself, I always came with that background of loving to sell. It’s kind of where the whole snowball started and how this book got created is, people would just come to me and be like, “Jason, you’d be that guy who sells like a refrigerator to someone who is living in the snow all the time.” And I’d be like, “Well, I wouldn’t if they don’t need it.” Only sell things that you really want to need, don’t be afraid to say no to a sale, find out if they actually need it. If they actually need it.

If you do notice that opportunity then, by all means, use every trick in the book to be able to ensure that they understand the value of what you’re selling because that’s not manipulation, that’s just empathy because when you know what you offer is so much more than what you ask in return. That’s when love comes into the sales process and this is really where the book came from, which is where I want to encourage more people who sell to understand how effective and how good it feels when you sell from a place of love.

If you’re able to do that, you can overcome the blocks you might have around selling. You can actually make an impact that you’ve always wanted to make in the lives of so many people when you realize that sales is everywhere and it doesn’t need to be that negative thing that most people associate with sales, it can and will be a beautiful thing, especially when you learn these methods.

Selling From A Place of Love

Frank Garza: Did you know when you were doing those pool sales at that young age, did you know that sales was the thing that you were going to do for a good part of your life?

Jason Marc Campbell: Yeah, when I was born, I knew it. It was basically like written on my birth certificate. No, it’s very interesting, at that time that I was doing pool sales, I was still in university and I was just trying to figure out what the hell I wanted to do with my life. There were these moments, I was going to this career fairs, I even did some internships for the government of Canada, I worked in procurement. The sales thing, it’s not really a career path that is like, “Wow, you know when I grow up, I want to be a salesperson.”

That doesn’t really happen. There’s not a lot of — I call it “good branding for being a salesperson”. Not good recognition either. I remember, when I was about to graduate from University, I was trying to find a career I’d be proud of. I’d studied management in school and so I’m going to these different positions and what happened is actually, my sister worked in real estate and she’s like, “Hey, you know if you’re trying to make some money while you’re a student, there are some really cool opportunities that happen in real estate.” So I ended up going there, starting as an inside sales agent, which is basically making phone calls.

I met with the owner of that company and he’s explaining to me what it is and I was like, “All right, this sounds like fun.” But trust me, it was terrifying when I started. Picking up the phone shaking, I’m like, “Oh my god, am I cold calling?” But a matter of fact, it was this thing, it was reverse prospecting which is a great strategy for reaching new leads but it was terrifying, you know?

The fear of rejection came up and all these insecurities came up but I started doing it, got better, got better and I started getting good at it. Then, wherever I was walking, wherever I would go, people had this understanding that this Jason Marc Campbell always had this enthusiasm for ideas and I would always be “selling them” but very unconscious, it came very naturally. 

I started being labeled more and more as the sales guy in any organization that I would go [to]. I started realizing, Well, guess what? There’s a competence, there’s a fun aspect of it and guess what, it pays the bills, it’s effective, it makes an impact. So I started really embracing that role only to discover that the industry itself has so many people that reject sales. They really don’t want anything to do with it and I’m like, why is it that everybody hates sales so much? I’m doing it, I’m loving it, I’m changing people’s lives. What’s going on here?

I started really sharing methodology and expanding on the topics, seeing the sources of that frustration and hoping to bust myths as well as getting people more excited about selling.

Frank Garza: When you decided to write this book and as you were writing it, who is the target audience that you had in mind?

Jason Marc Campbell: The target was very interesting because I would notice a pattern. I spoke on stages at a few conferences where you had these successful small business owners with quality products. They were doing some amazing things and then when it came to the part of selling, they would be like, “Yeah, we don’t want to do sales that way. There’s a way that we understand what sales is and we’re not one of them.”

When I realized there was so much resistance around sales, I started having conversations with these small business owners and they would have this great product, they’d be changing people’s lives with what they were doing, they had a vision of creating something extraordinary yet they couldn’t embrace the world of sales.

Matter of fact, it was even one specific customer that I always have come to mind when I think of avatar, right? Or target market. Her name is Tracy and she promotes freedom-centric practices for businesses. How to lead with democracy in an effective way that promotes freedom values. In the process, realized that sales was one of those necessary evils she had to do to reach her goals. 

What happened is, after the few conversations, I was able to explain to her this ethos, this manifesto, this methodology, this way of thinking about sales which is selling from a place of love. Well, she started realizing that you can actually have freedom-based principles around the way you sell.

The old guard around how to sell in a manipulative, douchey way that most people hate, with reason. It is bad, we expect more now and that’s a good thing. Now that we expect more what is the answer, well, when I speak to these small business owners who have ethical businesses delivering quality products, I can teach them how to sell from a place of love which feels good and works.

When you have that, you start realizing it’s not a necessary evil, it’s a core activity for your growth and success and it can be fun.

Everyone is a Salesperson

Frank Garza: The book is called, Selling with Love and it’s broken down into a part one and a part two. Can you talk about what is the objective for each part of the book?

Jason Marc Campbell: The first part is very interesting because if I’m going to teach someone how to sell with love, the premise first is maybe we have to not hate sales. I mean, you’re pretty much on the other side of the spectrum if you’re still at that point. The part one is really just making a case for maybe liking sales.

I’m not asking you to love, that’s a big ask from the beginning. Part one is all about, maybe you could like sales? I really break down, what are the typical upbringings that we have, why do we have stereotypes around sales? Most of us have the caricatures of what a salesperson is. If you’re listening to this, close your eyes — not if you’re driving — and imagine that salesperson. What does it look like? What are they wearing?h Ceap suit. What does their face look like? Crooked smile. What does their hair look like? Slicked back. You know, these are the typical responses that I would get, what are they selling, 

Let me ask you, Frank. What do you think is that typical stereotypical salesperson, what are they selling? 

Frank Garza: Used cars. I think of a used car salesman. 

Jason Marc Campbell: 95% of the people that ask that question say, “used car salesman.” I didn’t tell you to say used car salesman.

Frank Garza: Wow, you didn’t.

Jason Marc Campbell: It’s just what everybody thinks about. The media has given us this caricature, right? We’ve witnessed it but it’s also in our own personal experience or friends’ experience. Think about it, one of the first major sales we make. I know from in Canada, I’m from a small village, freedom was getting a car so you had more independence. The majority of us, the first car purchase may be happening at 16, 17, 18 years old when you get your driver’s license, you’re going to buy a car. 

Are you walking into a Mercedes dealership to buy a brand-new car? Probably not. You’re probably going to a used car lot and you’re trying to find a used car. Now, if you’re an amazing salesperson, the chances are, you might not build your entire career as a used car salesman. More than likely, you’re going to be moving out to sell like these Mercedes and high-end cars because there’s got to be more money in for you.

If you’re buying from your local used car dealership, you’re probably not dealing with the most sophisticated salesperson and so yeah, we might have one of these negative impressions with our first sales interaction but it becomes the impression that we judge every single sale after that.

I invite people to realize that [say], “Hey, there are so many things you have in your life, so many sales interactions that you’ve had, that if they were good, you probably don’t remember them.” They didn’t have that strong emotional charge like getting swindled out of a deal with your first purchase of a used car that ends up being a lemon, right? We forget these great sales experiences, we remember all the negative ones so we have a negative bias to our memory.

So, in the first beginning of the book, I am really getting people to understand, “You can actually change that.” There are ways you can actually realize that the best people that we appreciate —like who are some of the most famous people that you appreciate? Not labeled as anything, just famous people that you or anybody else would recognize that you look up to. Is there anybody that comes to mind? 

Frank Garza: Well, in the topic of sales, I mean, I always thought — 

Jason Marc Campbell: No, not topic of sales. Anybody. 

Frank Garza: I’m watching the — I’m going to say Steve Martin, which might be a little bit of a surprise but I am watching the show he’s on right now that’s why he’s top of mind. I read his biography and I really appreciate the story of him coming from basically nothing and building this hugely successful creative career.

Jason Marc Campbell: Beautiful, that’s actually a perfect example. You’re right, it’s the first one that I hear and I’m so glad because usually, I’ll get the Elon Musk, the Steve Jobs, and all of those typical entrepreneurs but Steve Martin… You’ve read his biography, right? 

Frank Garza: Yes. 

Jason Marc Campbell: The thing is, is Steve Martin a salesperson? 

Frank Garza: No. 

Jason Marc Campbell: Well? 

Frank Garza: Well, no. Okay, I get what you’re saying. I’m sure he’s had to sell plenty of deals for himself as an actor and a comedian and movies he’s been in and this new show that I’m watching now, I am sure you had to do a lot of selling to get people behind those projects. 

Jason Marc Campbell: Well, it’s interesting that you would hesitate because if it is an actor, you’re selling the role every moment you’re on the stage, right? 

Frank Garza: That’s true, yeah.

Jason Marc Campbell: If you are being selected as the actor, it’s a highly competitive field. You have hundreds of actors who apply for the same roles, what makes you stand out? You need to sell yourself that you’re the perfect one for the role. So I would say with enthusiasm that someone like Steve Martin is definitely a salesperson. It doesn’t mean that he’s got that slicked-back hair and the cheap suit, it’s actually because there are so many amazing ways to sell. 

[There’s] so many industries to sell and ideas that we can have about what a salesperson is, that we can expand ourselves and realize that we could imitate and emulate people that aren’t directly labeled as a salesperson but you can start appreciating the salesmanship that is happening everywhere, like just me having to get myself on a podcast to speak and promote my book. I need to sell it. 

If I want to get into the relationship that I want to be in, and I go on that first date, I need to sell myself. And what is one of the biggest asks or closing techniques to really spend the rest of your life with somebody — “Will you marry me?” 

A great closing technique. Sales is absolutely everywhere and this is really what I want to introduce in the first part of the book is make you realize that sales is everywhere and we’re all salespeople. If you decide to kind of demo-fy or vilify sales, you’re really just projecting this kind of shadow material and you’re denying a part that is core to every human experience — which is, we want to have an energy exchange with other people. 

We want to communicate, we want to get things, promote ideas, and make things happen. Everything that’s ever created in our existence is the result of a sale and so if you deny it, you miss out on so much things that could solve so many problems in your own life whether those are financial problems, relationship problems and really just some fulfillment promises or goals that you might have because if you want to get that dream job. Well, guess what? 

You’re going to go through an interview process. What’s that? It’s a sales process, so sales is everywhere and that’s really the first part in making you have new definitions of sales and really getting to understand more about how you can start liking sales. 

And then the second part, well, guess what? You have no choice. You are a salesperson so how can you do it from a place of love? I really break down in the first part the different emotions that you sell from, whether it’s from shame, you have blockages there. You can’t even sell to your fear-pride paradox where you’re kind of unconsciously selling but not taking responsibility to those who are sabotaging themselves rationally kind of panicking about having the sale and try to let the buyer have too much information and you’re not taking responsibility. 

You want the buyer to make the decision. You don’t want to lead them, to eventually learning how to sell with love, where you’re taking risks. You’re doing the best you can, you’re coming with a great product and you’re really wanting to care for the impact you make on the buyer and you’re leading them towards a decision that’s going to solve problems in their life. 

Understanding The Purpose Behind Each Sale

Frank Garza: When you open part two of the book, there’s a quote that says, “There are five major loves that need to be reviewed in order to sell from love more consistently.” And then there’s a chapter of each of these five major loves. Just to give — I know we don’t have time for a real deep dive on all of these but just to give our listeners a flavor for what some of these are, could you talk about the first one, “love your impact”? 

Jason Marc Campbell: I’d love to at least highlight what all these loves are and I can go a little deeper on the impact. The five loves, it’s no mystery. It’s love the impact, love the buyer, love the product, love the process, and love yourself. Those are the five loves in selling that I think are essential for someone to be in this place of love when they sell. Love the impact is where you start and it’s so important because when you start breaking down the reasons, the why from selling. I mean, for those who are fans of Simon Sinek, who know that you should start with why. 

Well, here’s where you start with “why” when it comes to selling. What’s the impact to the buyer that’s going to be a result of you making that sale? I’m holding a speaker, I have a speaker next to me. I have this beautiful speaker and I won’t say the brand because they’re not paying me to say the brand but I really love this speaker and you know, I had a lot of joy from it. For somebody who is selling a speaker, what’s the impact to the buyer? 

Well, the buyer will get quality sound, great — and you could really start elaborating so much more behind besides just the features of what they get. So when I would have to sell a speaker like this, I would say the buyer impact, I would start making a list. I’d go deep. I’d get really intimate with it, which is I am not just providing quality sound. I’ve given them the opportunity to entertain a crowd and getting them to experience movies at a whole new emotional level. 

I get to bring joy in their life in a way that if especially they’re an audiophile, they get a chance to really get immersed into any kind of experience. They get to enjoy the music to really shift their moods when it’s necessary whether they want to get into a heightened state of excitedness or whether they need to feel through some emotions because of sadness, there’s music that allows them to experience all of it. 

These are potential impacts that it can have on a buyer of this particular speaker. When you start really breaking it down, going on tangents, doing a thought experiment of really understanding the residual benefits of whatever it is that you’re selling that is going to have on the buyer, you are actually empowering yourself with really recognizing the impact and that can even translate in some of your marketing material, to be honest. But when you’re doing a sales presentation, it’s going beyond the “sell me this pen.” 

You are going to say, “Hey, these are all the things that you’re going to get as a benefit from what we’re about to do together.” So, get clear on the impact for the buyer. One of the things I introduce in this section is I really get people to go beyond just the buyer and realize, “What is the residual impact that happens to the world whenever a sale is made?” Now, this one I’d ask you to go on a big tangent but you start really understanding the purpose behind every sale that’s being made. 

If again, I’m using a speaker example, is that hey, guess what? If more people are feeling in a heightened state, they’re entertained, they’re happy, we actually get to lift the mood of the world. Maybe the person that has that speaker now can have better entertainment, host with friends. That has a ripple effect that allows more people to share joyful moments together and in a time where it seems like the joy is being sucked out of our lives, well now, you have music that can bring people together. 

Now you see a lot of this language being used by these major companies that really speak to the essence of why they do what they do. Well, when you start thinking about this world impact as a whole in the way that you sell or market anything you have, you start resonating at a higher level with people, which is going to help you sell not just because people will start understanding the why behind what you do but you’re also going to understand your why behind what you do. You’ll get more excited about selling it, which brings me to the third of these impacts at least in the major categories here is don’t always forget that you should look for the impact that you have for yourself. 

In this case, start thinking by selling this speaker, what’s the benefits that I get? and that’s not a selfish thing. That is actually a way for you to understand that you do deserve to have benefits from your sales transaction. Don’t become a martyr especially for those who are selling themselves and they want to cut the cost and they don’t want to take a profit for themselves, you want to acknowledge the impact for yourself. 

You want to generate the income. You want to be doing something you love, you want to promote the impact that you care about, you want to be able to provide for your family and when you have these three major elements, the more you flesh them out, the more you get clear on why you love the impact of every sale you make, it just makes you a very highly motivated, ethical, excited, and effective salesperson and that’s where you start. 

As you go through the other loves, you start refining and gaining in more clarity so that you end up with a manifesto for yourself and you start realizing that every time I step in front of a potential buyer, guess what? I’m coming with that energy of love, which translates into confidence and not that made-up confidence bravado and kind of fakeness that we hate from salespeople. But truly being there and understanding why you’re there and being able to ask questions and see if they are going to be someone who can benefit from the impact you want to make. 

Frank Garza: Jason, is there anything else about you or the book that you want to make sure our listeners know before we wrap up? 

Jason Marc Campbell: I think it would be interesting for people to understand the “why” this book is coming to place and you mentioned how I ended up doing some US real estate investment education. That came at an experience that I actually got taken through a real estate investment seminar experience with mentors, which cost a lot of money and didn’t necessarily deliver on the value that was promised. 

It was definitely in the grey area of sales and it was a terrible time in my life. I ended up being — okay, let’s start with the punch line — I’m okay but you know I went through a bit of depression. I had to take a bit of medication for a while. I just remember going crazy because the rug got pulled under from me and everything I’ve been taught was a bit scammy and I was selling to people I cared about and I thought I was doing wrong by them and it really shattered me. 

I wanted to make it right and I really had to scramble to self-educate myself and make the wrongs right. One of the motivators for why this book came to place is because I know that there is a lot of scammy “douchey” sales and marketing practices that exist out there and there’s a lot of people that get taken advantage of. So what I’m trying to do is to help give the tool to the ethical businesses to have success by understanding what can be used in sales and marketing so people notice you and choose you over another possible competitor or just someone that’s using the psychology that can manipulate people. 

I want the good businesses to win so nobody can go through the same crap that I went through and this comes two folds. I want to educate the seller to hold higher standards for themselves and I want to educate the buyers to not compromise on what they expect from salespeople. I find it amazing that in the last three years, I’ve interviewed because I host my own podcast, the Selling with Love Podcast, I have interviewed amazing salespeople. 

In the last three years, there’s been something like five different books that have come into the marketplace that are some variation of selling with love. It’s either you sell from love, selling from the heart, sell like we’re human. There is a shift where the ways of selling of the past are not good enough because buyer’s expectations have went up and that’s a great thing and now, the effective ways of selling are coming from the heart. 

They come with caring and I want to be a player that’s going to be moving that needle and educating people in the process. I am hoping for anybody who has these vision of creating something great that have hesitancies in sales, pick up my book, you’re going to realize that selling is a beautiful thing and you can do it from a place of love that doesn’t compromise on your values and that’s really what I wanted to share with everyone. 

Frank Garza: Well, thank you, Jason, for writing this book and putting it out into the world. I am excited about what you’re doing and congratulations because writing a book is such a feat. The book is called, Selling with Love. Besides checking out the book, where can people find you? 

Jason Marc Campbell: The easiest way to find me are on LinkedIn and on Instagram, the Jason Marc Campbell — Marc is with a C — you can add that to the show notes. I even have a cheat sheet for people to find out where the five loves of selling are, what they can do and of course, grab a copy of the book, it’s going to be out February 15th. 

Frank Garza: Thank you, Jason.